>The only "weak" spots in the YBA-1/A are the screen and supply dropping resistors. These are side-by-side on the circuit-card, and usually dissipate enough heat to discolour the schematic. The screen resistor is 470-10W while the supply unit is 5k-10W. You can save yourself some trouble in the future by installing individual 1k-5W screen resistors for each tube. And, Aaron, if you install 10R-1W cathode resistors, checking bias will be much simpler. All of these techniques and a full dissertation are available in "The Ultimate tone vol.2". Check our website for details:
I am restoring a Super Custom Special, and would like to use the right cloth. I also have a couple of Traynor speaker cabinets with wrong or missing cloth (a 6 X 10" and a 4 X 12").
Any suggestions?... walked into NJAM on the weekend and behold! ... a very mint 60's chiken knob YBA-1 for $375CDN (if this ain't a deal I dunno) ... apparently it's being sold by a guy who used to work at Traynor way back and actually put some of these together ... was given the number to chat with the guy ... any questions you want to pass on let me know ...
I'll give them a call tomorrow morning. (Hope this has the tube rectifier circuit) I know what you mean about having too much gear. Oh well one more amp at this price won't hurt.....
Thanks again, Greg
I've got a line on a Traynor Voicemaster PA head. Apparently, it runs 100 watts off a pair of EL34's. It's dirt cheap and supposedly in very good condition. Does anybody have any experience with these? Would the Voicemaster make a decent guitar amp?
Thanks. Rob
... the stock Voicemaster has grid-biased front end high-gain 12ax7 (ie true common-cathode) gain stages, the signal caps are maybe not the best values for guitar bandwidth range, the phase driver circuit is the single-tube cathodyne circuit which has less gain, uneven drive and clipping characteristics and a lower dynamic range than a typical diff-pair (long tail) circuit - the output circuit is same as in any guitar amp though, and the typical Traynor power supply is as in other Traynor amps of that time ...
the circuit may have a "novelty" sound stock, but if you're thinking of converting the signal path to a more guitar-prone response (tonal and dynamic) then here's an idea ...
the Voicemaster has enough tubes so that you can rearrange them into a Fender Tweed 5F-6/8-A signal path *plus* output modulating (Vibroverb oscillator and buffer) vibrato ... simply incorporate the 5F8-A Twin preamp circuit and phase driver circuit values (a single channel version !) and then wire in the vibrato circuit of the 6G11 Vibroverb amp in there ...
(* ... excuse me, FZ Zappa's on, playing Hungry Freaks, ... ahhh, so nice ...)
... if you like a natural, hot, xtal clear and responsive signal path then you might dig this mod ... even if the OT is cheezy on this amp (not saying it is) you should get a decent tone by using this time-proven signal path ...
... just came back from picking Morels in a few burns around BC and I ended up in Nelson where I saw a nice old 60's Bassmate (2xEL84) for $275CDN ... the place is called Eddy Music, (250)352/5224 fax 352/5424 ...
Would appreciate any advice your users group might have. I am an organist using a Korg BX-3 (which is a Hammond B-3 clone).
I am rebuilding a Leslie (rotating speaker) and since the original amp was missing, will need a replacement. The speaker unit comprises a 15" bass and an upper driver both 16 ohm. The (new replacement) speakers are rated at 100 watts. The original Leslie amp was 45? watts and the original speakers were rated at 60? watts
A keyboardist in the states suggested using a Fender Bassman as he was ecstatic with the resulting sound. Unfortunately the prices on the used Bassman's I've seen are a little too high for my taste.
Someone else recommended the Bassmaster as a good (possibly better) alternative. Essentially I'm looking for a warm, clear sound (as the organ has existing overdrive/distortion controls) and definitely want a tube amp to replace the original Leslie tube amp. I assume the Bassmaster at 50 watts would be sufficience for practice/jams or the odd pub gig.
I think using a Bass Master to power your speaker is an excellent idea - I have always loved the sound of Leslies - especially in small clubs etc where the swirling effect is most obvious.
There are two Bass Masters - the standard 50 watt YBA-1 Bass Master, and the 80 watt YBA-1A Bass Master Mark 2. They are almost identical in appearance (both had several different case styles over the years) and used the same tubes (3 12AX7/7025 plus a pair of 7027s in the very early models, and a pair of 6CA7/EL34 in all the later models. The Mark 2 has bigger transformers and is heavier, runs on a higher plate voltage, and has a fan to save it from meltdown.
I have a YBA-1 and a couple of YBA-1As. I think the standard Bass Master YBA-1does guitar distortion better, but the Mark 2 YBA-1A has a more solid tone for bass guitar. I think the extra clarity and punch of the YBA-1A would make it better for organ, but it is a matter of taste.
Music store don't distinguish between the two models - they are both listed as 50 watts because they have a pair of EL34s, and are sold for the same price. The days where Bass Masters were given away for $50 to $75 CDN are long gone, but there are still bargains out there ($150 to $175 CDN). Song Bird has asked for close to $300 for a Bass Master recently.
I would be interested to hear other opinions about the sound differences between the two Bass master models.
Eric
I recently purchased a 1973 Traynor Studio Mate without a front nameplate. Does anyone out there have a plate that they would be willing to sell so that I can get this great amp back into shape?
Tony Dudzik
I was hoping that you might point me in the right direction for a missing name plate. I have a 1973 Traynor Studio Mate and I would love to get it back into original condition. Any ideas/leads?
The ebay auction site has a traynor 100 watt head and a 4 x 10 cabinet up for auction. A picture is included, looks pretty clean.hi there. was just perusing the traynor website you setup and found that the links for ygm-3 schematics are broken. also, i'm looking for a manual for one, happen to have a lead?
thanks much for authoring this website, i happened upon my new amp (a '69!) on ebay and i love it. found out lots of good stuff from your site that gave me enough info to make the decision to buy it.
eryque
Someone else recommended the Bassmaster as a good (possibly better) alternative. Essentially I'm looking for a warm, clear sound (as the organ has existing overdrive/distortion controls) and definitely want a tube amp to replace the original Leslie tube amp. I assume the Bassmaster at 50 watts would be sufficience for practice/jams or the odd pub gig.
I agree with Eric that this (or the YBA2) would be a great setup ... though guitar amps were created with a certain degree of preamp distortion index, some git amps like early Marshalls or Fender Deluxes have a high preamp distortion index, and perhaps just in case you're looking for a little more headroom than a guitar player might want here's a little info you may want to know about ...
if you want to maximize the clean sound of any guitar amp that uses a single branch filter distribution network throughout the amp (as this amp and almost all do) then what you may want to do is reduce the R component of the RC network ...
... in the early Bassmaster the RC network has a fairly high preamp distortion index, and in fact is backwards compared to most amps (ie Fender related) ... that is, the first resistor in the RC network coming off the choke is usually higher than the one following it but in the early bassmaster we have a 4.7k followed by a 10k ... if I recall correctly the early Bassmaster B+ voltage is around 450 volts (unlike the YBA2 which runs at 530v or somthing) ... this means you can reduce these resistors and have the preamp tubes running with more headroom, which is what you want to do to reduce preamp distortion and make the amp cleaner to a degree ...
I'd recommend you bring the 4.7k down to 2.2k and then experiment with replacement values for the 10k going lower in increments (say 6.8k, 4.7k, 2.2k and finally 1k no lower, all 1w) ... because the voltage to the preamp will increase by decreasing the series resistance one must be careful because depending on the strength of the B+ you can bring this feed voltage to a (high) degree where you start exceeding plate dissipation when the amp is driven extra hard ... in Twin and Super Silverface amps I have found it acceptable to have 2.2k and 1k running there ...
by reducing the filter resistance you get an overall cleaner response and an even more pentodish distortion when overdriving the amp because the power tubes will cream up before the triode stages will ... of course this will alter the character of the amp slightly and you may not like that, so there's a subtle compromise ... it's good to play the amp lots before playing with this series resistance, then play the amp lots after so you can better tell which suites your needs more ... you may like the distortion character of a stock YBA1 ... which is very nice ... conversely you can use the YBA1 values on a high headromm guitar amp to give it more YBA1-style triodicity ... there's no ultimate choice, depends and you ...
incidently, I use an Ampeg (7027A) V4 between my Rhodes or '49 B2 and 122 Leslie and the sound/breakup is phenomenal (many Ampeg amps, especially those for Bass, were designed with less breakup than other brand amps) ... there's always been a tendency to use high headroom tube amps on keyboards, or to modify them for this
... all else said I think a 50w YBA1 amp would be a great choice ... I've gotten two positive emails in the last week from guitar players who recently bought early Bassmasters ... these amps are capable of producing very nice harmonics and dynamics indeed ... very nice harmonics on a guitar signal, very nice harmonics on an organ signal ... what the hey ... :)~
>if I recall correctly the >early Bassmaster B+ voltage is around 450 volts (unlike the YBA2 which runs at 530v or somthing)
I think you mean the YBA-1A (Bass Master Mark 2) not the YBA 2 (Bass Mate) which, (according to the schematics on your site!) uses a couple of 6
BQ5s at less than 400 volts.
Eric
I was pleased to find you page. I currently own 3 Bass Master heads and one Bass Mate head which has 6V6 outputs rather than the EL84 variety. Have you seen this output tube complement in a Bass Mate before?
Also, the Bass Mates that I have appear to be 70 and 71 year models which do not have the choke as on the 66 models. Is there any differences in tone and/or circuit differences between the 66 and 70's vintage amps?
V/R, Bob Parks
I just scored a YGL-1 Mark III combo in a pawnshop for $150 US.
They were asking $195, but I whined about the reverb not working and the footswitch being missing until they dropped the price.
Someone had installed Peavey speakers ( which is probably okay, as I understand the original speakers weren't so great anyway) and replaced the grill cloth with what looks like window screen.
But when I opened up the top, the electronics look all original -- it's got the big Mallory paper two-section filter caps, etc. This is almost bad news -- half the reason I bought it was as a platform for modifications, but it seems almost a shame to disturb the beautiful work that was done some 26 years ago!
I'd be interested to hear about anybody else's experiences with modding or restoring Mark IIIs or any other old Traynors.
I recently (cosmetically) restored a beat-up Mark III. I didn't need to do anything to the electronics or tubes. They're working perfectly.
>Someone had installed Peavey speakers ( which is probably okay, as I understand the original >speakers weren't so great anyway)
I ditched the speakers in my Mark III and put in a pair of Celestion G12T75's. What a huge improvement! A pair of good speakers will make an enormous difference.
>and replaced the grill cloth with what >looks like window screen.
LOL!
Mine had some heavy guage chicken wire stuff on it and had shiny metal studs stuck all over the amp. I retolexed it and built a new front but didn't have a Traynor badge to stick on it. But I did have a nice metal "Acetone" badge that I stuck on the grill. You should see the looks I get when I gig with this amp...
>But when I opened up the top, the electronics look all original -- it's got the big Mallory paper >two-section filter caps, etc. This is almost bad news -- half the reason I bought it was as a >platform for modifications, but it seems almost a shame to disturb the beautiful work that was >done some 26 years ago!
If you like the way it sounds, why mess with it?
Rob
I recently read someone mention that the right speakers can make a huge difference in the sound of these old amps. I am using a 1971 YBA-1 Bass Master. I got it and an acoustic 6x10 cab for $250 us dollars. ANYHOW...if I were to buy a brand new cabinet, are there any suggestions for what would be a match made in heaven for my amp? I use it for bass and guitar, so maybe suggestions for each instrument would be helpful......You guys let me know, and thanks.stevie_rob@hotmail.com wrote:
I was thinking about Celestion Vintage 30s, or maybe the Jensen reissues that are starting to show up.
Partly for the experience, and partly because I'm not completely happy with the sound. I'd like to be able to get a more overdriven sound, while still keeping that trademark clean sound when I want it.Has anyone here experimented with using 5881s and/or 6V6s in a Mark III?
It seems that with a plate voltage of 431 volts, good 6V6s and any 5881 would work well. --
Billy Chambless MS State University Engineering Research Center
I think the Mark III is loosely based on the Fender Twin design concept of CLEAN and LOUD. I'd be interested to hear what it does to the V30's or the reissue Jensens. You might want to be careful tho, at 100 watts, you might blow them up if you crank your Mark III.
I also recommend you check out Ted Weber's speakers at www.webervst.com. I've been very impressed with his speakers. I also believe he's a dealer for the reissue Jensens.
Rob
hey i was on your site and was wondering if you could tell me the best tube traynors to prchase (80-100) watts that would be good for beefy rock and roll??
If you could let me know I would appreciate it alot.
My name is doug and i love rock and roll
>My general thoughts of the sound of the Mk3 is that it is both shrill and boomy. Not particularly pleasing to me. Could be that my speakers are unsuitable. I have just put in a triode/pentode switch. Sounded good when I tried it right by the workbench but until it is tested with a proper cab and a band present.... The mod also has the avantage that it doubles the 'dynamic' screen resistance and so 6L6:s can be used if desired.
I'm also thinking about adding a triode switch (or two), also about experimenting with different power tubes. Liuke you, I haven't had a chance to take it out and crank it up yet.Thanx alot for the reply man i appreciate it alot.
If you don't mind once I get my hands on some yba1's I may write again... and if you know anyone that is selling any send them my email if that is cool.
As a rule do the yba1's need any mods???? Tube or otherwise???
I am an old guy from the Georgian Bay area north of Toronto and I have what I would estimate to be the ideal bass amp combo.
As a kid of 14 I started playing bass through an old Traynor Bassmaster with one single 15" Traynor box (Marsland equipped with original leather handle!) At 16 years of age I added a second single 15" box (again with a Marsland) and purchased A Burns of London Jazz Bass (circa 1964)
Finally at 18, I bought the YBA-3 and added two JBL D140F speakers to my boxes! After a wonderful marriage and a continuing carrier in electronics I finally added an active 5 band EQ and built it into the front panel (upper left where the second input jack was) The EQ is controlled by a foot switch and has separate volume. The EQ is wired into the main amp driver tube via relay so as not to upset the original cct when off! Dynamic tests into the four OHM load with standard 1 khz input level and scoped output reveal clipping of less than 10 % at 175 watts! At 100 hz into 4 Ohms, the wife made me shut her down cause the house was shakin! The old Girl was approaching 200 watts! All the controls were max and bass /bright switches were on.
In the years of playing all types of music, this configuration allowed me to stack for punch (right next to the drummer) , lay the speakers down together for (best lows) and even spread them around on stage to fatten up the stage sound of a smaller group.
The non linear volume control is never past 2 for most halls and I have at one time blown the ²"back off one cab in a rage of volume, ripping the voice coil lead in wire right off! , finishing the night on one box. I'm much more conservative these days.. The boxes are sealed with hot glue ( the removable type!), the rear cover has 48 wood screws and the Lansings have been repaired a few times but continue to perform like new.
The tubes are replaced once a year faithfully with American new old stock tubes and the big power supply caps are tie wrapped down! (trust me on this one) (The ¹" speaker jacks have been replaced with XLRs) and the handles have been replaced a few times.
Although these days, we utilize a sound man more often than not, I still welcome any arena or outside venue with the old Traynor It has never failed me and although some solid state stuff has a tighter sound, I've never felt jealous of anyone when it comes to volume or tone.
Thanks..... Dave Atkinson
I need a qualified tech. in the Seattle, WA area to give a YBA-1 Bass master an overhaul...!
anyone out there to give me a reference?Unfortuneately, I don't have a vehicle, but could you give me your info just in case, if you don't mind? If I end up taking a vacation up there, it's a possibility.
Hello everyone. Some others and myself are thinking of using the Mark III style transformerless EL84 driven reverb in a homebrew amp. I was wondering if any of you who have a mark3 with an Accutronics pan in it, could give me the model number. >Thanks
I believe the number is 4FB2R1C but I also believe it's a bad idea to copy the MkIII reverb. It is one of Traynor's few design flaws. Maybe Ampeg has some better transformer-less designs to clone?
Olof Westman
I used a pair of LCR 50+50 @500VDC in my Mark III. Antique Electronic Supply has a 40 +40 cap @ 500 VDC described as a clamp cap in the catalogue but I don't know if it's the same type that Traynor used.
Dave
>I'm pondering doing a cap job on my Mark III. Does anyone know of a source for the 40x40 filter caps, >or should I just take the easy way out and replace each with a pair of 40uf Sprague Atoms or >something similar? >--
>Billy Chambless >MS State University Engineering Research Center billy@erc.msstate.edu
If I had a choice between 40uf Atom's and 50uf LCR's I'd go with the Atom's every time.
The lower value filter caps are a key ingrediant in the early Traynor sound. I too have not found a good source for the 40x40uf can caps. You can keep the original cans in place and wire in the Atom's using terminal strips. Then the chassis still looks original from the outside anyway.
Let me know if you find a source.
G. Crask
I have strayed away from my Traynor roots...I have two Custom Special one from the old days CS-479 that I used back then. I picked up a '78 SF Twin Reverb last year and a '67 SF Bassman this summer. I have a shot at a '64 BF Bandmaster for just under $400 CN.
I was headed out to make a deal for the amp but my wife arrived home after cracking up the family van. I'm not sure if I have more latitude or less now. I've heard that the Bandmaster sucks. However it sure conjures up images from my childhood that are hard to deal with. What do you think?
Thanks.
Terry
P.S. Not looking for power have an Orange hanging around. Use with Precision, Telecaster, Stratocater and Les Paul.
I saw a post of your's about Traynor amps and I hope I'm not bugging you about the topic. I'm a bassist and I'm using an old Sunn Model T for my main head. I'm looking for a backup and I'm considering the YBA-1. I know that it doesn't compare in power to my Sunn, but it should be enough for the med-sized gigs I play. Plus, if I don't like it as a bass head, I can always use it in my guitar amp collection, especially since I don't own a Bassman or Marshall Plexi!
Anyway, I may have a line on a YBA1. How did the models change ie. from different reading, I assume the '60's versions are different than the '70's? How can I tell between the two?
I appreciate any other info you can give me!!
Thanks a bunch,
Troy
This unit uses 6V6 outputs and I would like to know approx what year it is. Also, there are several choices of Output tubes used in Base Master and Vocal Master Traynors ....is there a significant change in the sound of the Amp with the different tubes??
CW
I was looking a photo of John Lennon on the cover of the box for the DVD video "Sweet Toronto Peace Festival." It looks like he's playing through a Traynor piggy back rig. Can anyone confirm this and provide more details? The year is right (1969), the location is right (Toronto). The promoters could have very well provided the amps, as I read where Lennon and Clapton were real last-minute additions (the band never even rehearsed). It's real hard to see the details in the picture, but what you can make out jives with the placement of the Traynor knobs and logos. Thanks for any info anyone can provide.
Dave Register
As far as I know, the 'mate' series of amps (Bass Mate, Guitar mate etc.) changed tube types from 6V6 to 6BQ5/EL84 at about the same time as the 'master' series (Bass Master, Voice Master etc.) changed from 7027 (very similar to a 6L6) to 6CA7/EL34 tubes - about 1970.
The 1970 Bass Mate on jc's viva Analog uses 6BQ5s: http://www.lynx.bc.ca/~jc/70_YBA2A_B_BsMate.gif
However, the 66 Guitar Mate also uses 6BQ5s, which kind of trashes my theory: http://www.lynx.bc.ca/~jc/66_YGM2_GtrMate.gif
Does anyone know more about this? It would be nice to hear from other owners of 6V6 Traynors.
In theory, the early 6V6 and 7027 amps should be better suited to Fender type tones, whereas the later amps with EL84 and EL34 tubes should have more of a Marshall/Vox sound. I'm not sure it works out as simply in practice though - there are a lot of other factors.
Personally, I think 6V6 tubes have more class than the ubiquitous EL84/6BQ5s - but I wouldn't want to claim this is more than prejudice.
>As far as I know, the 'mate' series of amps (Bass Mate, Guitar mate etc.) changed tube types from 6V6 to 6BQ5/EL84 at about the same time as the 'master' series (Bass Master, Voice Master etc.) changed from 7027 (very similar to a 6L6) to 6CA7/EL34 tubes - about 1970.
>Personally, I think 6V6 tubes have more class than the ubiquitous EL84/6BQ5s - but I wouldn't want to claim this is more than prejudice.
I saw a BassMate in a pawn shop early this year (at $200US, I passed) and it had 6V6s. No idea what year it was. Bought a non-reverb GuitarMate (with EL84s) shortly thereafter for $100. Visit us at: http://www.homestead.com/macmillan/index.html
I am coming to rely on your advice entirely too much. I will try to be brief. And I will repay you by sending you a copy of an early seventies Traynor brochure, if you want it. It's different from anything I've seen on your site, and encompasses the whole line. I have it in storage presently on the other side of the country but I go home for thanksgiving.
I am looking for an amp: either a garnet or a traynor. If you would be so kind as to give me a quick recommendation as to what model and year (if the year makes a difference as to sound).
Traynors seem to be fairly common so I could probably pick and choose. On the other hand I know where there is a Garnet Deputy II (if still unsold) and those don't grow on trees. I am looking for Marshall type sounds more than Fender. I will be modding (respecfully, and reversably) for master volume (I don't need no deafness, thank you very much) and channel switching if necessary. Reverb and trem would be nice but not a requirement. Prefer 50 watts to a hundred. And I know it's a weird thing but I really hate heads that are 4-12 cabinet width, they're ugly and, more importantly, unwieldy. But, ultimately, tone and features rules (over dimensions).
I have been reading your email files but so far I haven't been able to find the info I need and I don't want to let that Garnet get away..., should that be your recommendation. If you're too busy perhaps you could forward to someone else who could help???
Thank you for whatever help you can offer. gene.
>But.. I am going to transfer things over to One list
>The email address will be traynor-amps@onelist.com, but I'll sort out details on how to sign up tomorrow. If you want me to sort out transferring you over I may be able to do that.
That is a very sensible idea. I am on several onelist mailing lists and they work well.
Eric
hey jc, i once again seek your wholesome guideance.
I have a chance to buy a 69' yba-1 bassmaster for $300 I tried it out and had serious problems, so they are going to repair it, add a three prong cord...and then let me try it when repaired.
Also I am getting all new tubes if i make the purchase. I think i will try 6l6's in the power section and 7025's in the pre amp stage, to copy the same tubes used in the blond bassman heads.
Do you think these tubes would be the correct choice for "beefy" power rock, or would you make another suggestion? Also as general maintenance i will get new input jacks, control pots ect. Is there anything else you would recommend i do to this amp if i decide to buy. I don't know that much about amps, thats why I ask kind people like yourself for advice.
HAve a happy thanks giving, and keep the jams hott. Thank you for your time